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Is it possible to automatically delete the invisible double spaces at the end of a segment?

Ineke Kuiper

Is there a setting that makes it possible to automatically change double spaces at the end of a segment into single spaces? These spaces are not shown in the segment itself, so I cannot do so while translating. They are in the source document, since this seems to be customary in US texts, but in Dutch, we use only one space.

Of course I can do a search and replace, but I cannot do so automatically, since there usually are a number of places in my texts where a number of spaces are deleted (if only the people writing these texts would learn how to NOT do that), so I would have to check each double space manually, which can be quite time consuming.  

So it would be so nice if Trados would give me the option to edit the intersegment spaces. Is that possible?
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  • 0

    Unknown said:

    Is there a setting that makes it possible to automatically change double spaces at the end of a segment into single spaces? These spaces are not shown in the segment itself, so I cannot do so while translating.

    Ineke

    These spaces should show up if you enable the display of spaces. To do this, click on the "paragraph icon" in the View part of the ribbon and you will see small dots wherever there is a space.

    I know this problem of double spaces with US texts and it is annoying. On the other hand, I am surprised you still get this because this was a habit in US long time ago and it is disappearing, meaning that younger people do not follow this rule anymore. 

    What I used to do with these texts was to open them in Word before translation and replace all occurrences of "a dot followed by two spaces" by "a dot followed by one space".

    Beste groeten.

    Walter
  • 0 in reply to Walter Blaser

    Walter, thank you for your reply.
    However, making spaces visible (which is a standard setting for me) doesn't do the trick. These double spaces are not shown in Trados. There are NO spaces at the end of my segments in Trados, not one, not two. So I cannot delete anything in Trados.

    Since I am a medical translator, I am not surprised that my texts in general will not be written by the younger generation. I do encounter this problem quite often. And if there is no way to solve this in Trados, my clients will keep the double spaces in the return package I usually have to send them.

    I do not always get the Word files, and even if I do, if I get a package from a cliënt, editing the word files in the source texts doesn't help either.

    I am not looking for a workaround, I have worked around this already for many years.
    I am looking for a solution, and one might expect with all the new versions Trados is promoting, that annoying problems like this one should have been solved.
  • 0 in reply to Klaus Lauble
    I completely disagree that this is a bug in Studio. It's definitely not! Studio is faithfully reproducing the style of the source document. The verified answer was presumably marked up by whoever asked the question, so I think that's ok too. If it doesn't answer the problem for you then opening another thread would be simple enough.

    However, I do think a solution could be found and this would be an enhancement. If SDL don't make this an option perhaps something through the AppStore, but it's not a bug.

    Paul Filkin | RWS Group

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  • 0 in reply to Paul

    I tried using the All Content option, also showing the parts between segments, but they show one space, not too. And that space therefore cannot be deleted by searching for double spaces and replacing it with one space, so I would then have to delete all of these single in-between-segments spaces manually. And this is undoable. It is then less work to open the target files and delete the double spaces there, unless the file is of bad formatting quality, meaning that the source file already contains many spaces instead of tabs, for instances for underlining parts where something has to be entered later, by the user of the end product.

    Next to that, I then also delete all the unnecessary spaces before a return.
    It would be nice it that could be done automatically too.

    The problem would be solved if there would not be any in-between-segment-characters, including spaces.
    I for one would not mind if the return would be part of the segment. It would make it a lot easier to edit them too.
    If only in-between-segments-code would stay hidden (but made visible with 'all content') it would be an improvement, I guess.
  • 0 in reply to Paul
    Paul, I never said it was a bug in Studio, but it is an unwanted consequence of making certain parts of a text invisible/not part of a segment.

    And regarding the ''answered' state, my question was answered, there is a solution by showing 'all content', but it is a time consuming solution, that doesn't really work, for that reason.

    As said in my earlier answer: I would prefer to be able to see and edit all content.
    At the moment I am translating a book with many conversations in it. Many parts of that book are indented. This has meaning. However, I do not see that in Trados, so I often have to check the book with part is still part of the indented part, and which part isn't.

    All the same, there are times when the quotation marks are part of the segments, and other times when they are not. Why?
    As said, I would like to see ALL of the format and characters (including spaces) in a segment, to do the best job in the least time.
  • 0 in reply to Ineke Kuiper
    This brings up again the old debate about what a CAT tool should do and what not.
    Basically, the task of a CAT tool is to translate the "translatable" content of a document keeping its layout and formatting. This means that the target file will have the same layout and formatting as the source file.
    If the source file is badly formatted - whatever that means, it is and individual judgment - it is not up to the CAT tool to correct this, but to the author of the document or in a translation workflow to the project manager/translator. If the source document does not fit what you expect, then you ought to change it before you open it in Studio. This is the only proper way to ensure that your target documents look the way you want them to look.

    Walter
  • 0 in reply to Walter Blaser
    I agree that this is not a bug and that Studio is simply doing what it's supposed to be doing. The way I see this issue, which also affects our translations from time to time is that there are three solutions:

    1. Pre-translation: remove the extra spaces in the source document before processing it in Studio

    2. During translation: an alternative to Walter's excellent advice about displaying all content and making the change there (which would be my preferred method) is the option to use paragraph-based segmentation instead of sentence-based segmentation so the spaces between sentences will be shown as part of the segment to be modified during translation. After all, those extra spaces are part of the paragraph, not part of the sentence, and therefore there's nothing that can be done about them at sentence level. Here one would need to weigh which is more important and the greater time saver: using sentence-based segmentation and therefore probably getting better leverage from existing TMs or getting rid of the extra spaces within the segment during the translation process.

    3. Post-translation: remove the unwanted spaces in the target file. It's easy to create a macro for finding and replacing all instances of one dot followed by two spaces with one dot followed by one space. Then a shortcut to the macro can be placed in the Word ribbon and it will take one click to conduct this operation whenever needed.
  • 0 in reply to Ineke Kuiper

    Unknown said:
    At the moment I am translating a book with many conversations in it. Many parts of that book are indented. This has meaning. However, I do not see that in Trados, so I often have to check the book with part is still part of the indented part, and which part isn't.

    All the same, there are times when the quotation marks are part of the segments, and other times when they are not. Why?
    As said, I would like to see ALL of the format and characters (including spaces) in a segment, to do the best job in the least time.

    Hi Ineke,

    This sounds like one of those jobs where paragraph-based segmentation might be better than sentence-based segmentation.
  • 0 in reply to Nora Díaz
    Hi Nora,

    No, not really. There are many long sentences in this file already, and apparently Multiterm only looks up some 20 terms or so. If a sentence is longer, it skips the last part. Very annoying.
    So if I would change to paragraphs, there would be many more segments in which Multiterm doesn't look up all the words it 'knows', and since I highly value this option, it is of no use.

    Next to that, for this book, I made the project myself, so I was able to edit the source files beforehand. And even later on, once again, too.

    But when my clients send me a package, they have created it, with their source file, and their TM and then I am not able to edit the source file, will have to work with what they gave me.
  • 0 in reply to Ineke Kuiper
    Hi Ineke,
    Have you already thought about working with paragraph segmentation, in the case you don't have that much repetitions? You would see all spaces between sentences which are in the same paragraph. Spaces at the end of paragraph (= before a return) and at the beginning (indent) won't still be displayed. Which format is your original file? You may have possiblity there to "batch" erase spaces.
    Sébastien
  • 0 in reply to Ineke Kuiper
    Hi Ineke

    Just a small hint about handling packages: it is very well possible to edit the source document included in the package. Edit the source document and replace the one in the source language folder, then run a "Prepare" task on this file.

    Walter
  • 0 in reply to Sébastien Desautel
    Sebastien

    This has been already suggested but if you read the previous post you will see that it does not fit Ineke's most jobs.

    Walter
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