This helps, but seriously, ctrl B= make it bold, again ctrly B= make it not bold. Is this too hard to implement... Bold is older than tags... 

I never said it is rocket science. This is simply the way it works here. A paragraph is bolded, so the tags for this are treated external and kept out of the paragraph. Most of the translators I know are thankful not to have to see any tags. So from this point of view keeping all unnecessary information out of sight is the best help the program can give you. And once again, even if other tools offer that, I still think, that a CAT tool is not really intended to insert any extra formatting into the translated documents. This is not the aim of such program.

My God, you have time to write. I just checked memsource, it also does as I would suggest. MemoQ, Wordfast, memsource are also cat tools. Anyways, good night/day. 

It seems like would this tools better suit your purposes.

I work on very complicated projects and very simple projects. I would like a tool that works in most conditions easily, saves me time and complies with my Microsoft Office habbits to the extent reasonably possible. Don't make it sound like MemoQ is less advanced. Or what I am suggesting/asking is a complicated gibberish. Good night. Sir. 

I do not really care how advanced or not are other tools. In my opinion Studio does exactly what I (and many other users) expect from a CAT tool.

Taken this example into another world: I drive BMW and expect it to look and feel like a BMW. When I wanted a Mecedes, I wouldn't buy a BMW. And there is no Mercedes which has exactly the same features as BMW. The other way round there is no BMW offering exactly the same as Mercedes.

So find a tool for your purpose and accept, that there might be different ways of doing things. No tool will be perfect and most probably there will be no tool to satisfy al your needs and all the needs of other translators in just one package.

You just verified my point. You have lots of time. Good night. 

Obviously not more than you. Enjoy your night too.

halit yilmaz

halit yilmaz said:

Knowing that almost 80% of content localization come in word form

Perhaps for you... but definitely not for the industry in general where XML formats are definitely more and not by a small amount.  Ultimately I think the important point here is that a CAT tool sees everything as simply tags and in general you should be taking the tags from the source and not introducing new types of tags to the document unless the source didn't have them in the first place.

So for this a consistent way of working with all types of tags is far more sensible.  I can see where you're coming from, but I also think it needs a change in mindset to think about how you work.

I often think the whole idea of wysiwyg in the editor and hiding the tags by default is a mistake.  I think translators should focus on the text and work without wysiwyg and also show the tags at all times.  The exception being when reviewing where I think it can be helpful to turn off formatting tags at least to be able to focus on the written text for fluency.

First of all, I like your helps, I must say. Thanks for the contributions. But still, If so many other cat tools do it my way, it is clear that I have a very solid point. I know where usage of tags is better and where it is not. I explained above already. We differ, like you differ with many of the said CAT tools with equally(or more) advanced processes and teams behind... I am ok with tags after all, I was just annoyed by the "know it all" comments in a repeated manner. My point is equally solid, you can prefer other ways, I should not have been in need of googling "bold not working properly" after installation and starting usage with default settings. This alone proves my point several times over. Anyways, I still have termbase problems that have no fixing obviously, it slows the entire thing too much while MemoQ and wordfast are extremely fast in these fields. But I guess it is also necessary to spend 2 seconds for the results to show since it is a CAT tool and maybe I should choose another tool if I don't like the rituals of Trados that I had one or two all the time since 2012... Too large TM not usable anymore is another problem I suffer... But of course this is how it should be. definitely. Choose other tools if you dont like it. Sure. (the annoyance is not towards you, but to the other gent.)

and these ways of thinking removed the luxury of adding highlights quite quickly that we used to enjoy... It is not us translators who made trados a secondary software. It is your people who made the software a secondary one. Just because of habit, I still use the software I paid to be a comprehensive solution to my CAT tool needs. Analysis of a 500 page document takes more than 10 minutes while memoq does it in 50 seconds... Trados stagnates even while working on such big files. It could be otherwise. It could be dominating 70% of the industry. It is not, because someone somewhere within trados thinks it is good to be hypocrites in know-it-all arrogance unfortunately. Maybe instead of trying to answer equally fiercely 16th time, take this as a golden feedback... it might serve your company... 

and these ways of thinking removed the luxury of adding highlights quite quickly that we used to enjoy... It is not us translators who made trados a secondary software. It is your people who made the software a secondary one. Just because of habit, I still use the software I paid to be a comprehensive solution to my CAT tool needs. Analysis of a 500 page document takes more than 10 minutes while memoq does it in 50 seconds... Trados stagnates even while working on such big files. It could be otherwise. It could be dominating 70% of the industry. It is not, because someone somewhere within trados thinks it is good to be hypocrites in know-it-all arrogance unfortunately. Maybe instead of trying to answer equally fiercely 16th time, take this as a golden feedback... it might serve your company... 

halit yilmaz

halit yilmaz said:

removed the luxury of adding highlights quite quickly that we used to enjoy.

There are a couple of apps that you might find useful for this:

https://appstore.sdl.com/language/app/wordlight/1026/

https://appstore.sdl.com/language/app/wordbird/890/

halit yilmaz said:

Analysis of a 500 page document takes more than 10 minutes while memoq does it in 50 seconds... Trados stagnates even while working on such big files.

Yes, this can be a problem in Trados Studio.  The 2021 version has been significantly improved in this area, but certainly there are always areas where we can improve.

halit yilmaz said:

Maybe instead of trying to answer equally fiercely 16th time, take this as a golden feedback... it might serve your company... 

I didn't think I was being fierce and I'm the only SDL employee in this thread.

So, requiring apps instead of just doing it like we used to before, that is progress... I am a fervent purchaser of my softwares and I did not buy Trados 2019 for a reason. I hope your team will eventually understand. I hope to buy 2021 if the termbase failure will stop... I desperately need it and you don't provide it to me... I tried fixing for several times and now I even forgot what the problem was... I think i might try fixing it with your help when I have some time to think about it. Thank you :) 

Paul said:

There are a couple of apps that you might find useful for this:

halit yilmaz said:

So, requiring apps instead of just doing it like we used to before, that is progress..

halit yilmaz

Really?  Like you used to in Trados 2007 and earlier a decade ago.  When you used to work in Word?

no, in trados 2011 it was possible. After an update or something it got sacked I think. I remember using ctrl shift 5 or 9 or something like that for it.

halit yilmaz said:

It is not us translators who made trados a secondary software. It is your people who made the software a secondary one.

Hi halit yilmaz

I can't agree, SDL Trados Studio and MultiTerm are not secondary software. Users can end up making them less well-performing by not maintaining them properly, failing to keep them up-to-date and/or by not using them in the way in which they are designed to be used.

Studio is neither a wordprocessing nor a desktop publishing tool  so it's not really logical to try to use it as one.

As Paul says, the majority of work these days comes in one of several XML-based formats (DOCX is XML-based, actually) and when the text is at that level, for example XML or XLF formats generated by automatic online Content Management System software, you have to use the precise tags that the original format requires or the software may fail to reimport translated content due to not recognising tags. 

Then with the desktop publishing software, if you embolden something with basic tags that the end product will not understand even if it's a human-generated format (for example, InDesign, FrameMaker, QuarkXpress, Interleaf Quicksilver) you can cause reconversion failure for example, or the tags to end up in the final document as text which is also undesirable to the end customer - especially if they give you the sdlxliff files to translate and return without access to the end files. I'm presuming this is the case or you would be able to do your final formatting in Word if they give you Word files.

I'm no expert but I've learned that a tool should be used in the way it is designed to be used, to achieve the best results. As Jerzy Czopik says, if you want a BMW then buy a BMW, not a Merc.

All the best,

Ali (not an SDL employee)

halit yilmaz said:

no, in trados 2011 it was possible. After an update or something it got sacked I think. I remember using ctrl shift 5 or 9 or something like that for it.

halit yilmaz

ok - you're not talking about real highlighting which is what's on offer with the plugins.  You just mean this:

This has always been in the software and it's still there now.  You can find it here:

When we moved from the old toolbar to the ribbon things got moved around and this was moved to here.  It's a poor solution to be honest as there is no keyboard equivalent and we never resolved this unfortunately.  But you can "fix" it with AutoHotkey.

However, the plugins I gave you are a far superior solution, especially the Wordlight plugin (in my opinion) as it's well integrated with the Advanced Display Filter and offers you a variety of colours to choose from as you go.  It's also available for all filetypes and not just Microsoft Word.

So a good example of where using apps, that are a 5 second job to install in 2021, is definitely beneficial and are a real part of the overall solution you pay for.  Not a workaround at all, rather a way to keep the application lighter since not everyone wants these features.  There are hundreds of app.... most things you probably won't need at all, but they are things many users do want and often help integrate with their own internal systems.

I think you're probably quite limited in your use of the software and can see how this influences your views... all perfectly understandable.  But I don't think it's as bad as all that :-)

I used to be "all in" in Trados in 2012 until 2018, then I was fed up with things, I purchased MemoQ. When 2017 was available, I purchased (before, I was working in an office) and then I saw many things not working nicely in 2017 (I have a TM of 3 GB with 12 years of content accumulated) (Also your termbase is so slow and gives errors unexpectedly...) So I moved things to MemoQ but I still like using Trados because of habits of many years I guess. So, I stopped digging for answers. But now I intend to change things. I used to train people in trados, the tips and tricks, all that in 2013... Now I don't think trados appreciates having clients to be honest. I will probably buy 2021 and if things dont work in it properly, I will be a headache for you guys. Lets end the conversation here. Thank you for your helps. 

I think all companies appreciate customers. However, there are limits to this appreciation and no company will change a major product just because one customer does not like some particular function in it.

This said, I admit, that there are things working better in memoQ, but when I take the whole package into consideration, there is no other tool on the market giving you as much freedom as Studio does. And in general it works quite nicely. I have two TMs (A->B and B->A), containing all my stuff since 2003, so even longer than you. I use Studio since 2009 and have been using Trados before since 2001. I also use Transit, memoQ and (when forced to do so, and really only as an huge exception) Across. I also used to translate with Memsource or MateCat. None of this programs can offer you what Studio does: working in the way YOU decide. All other tools have a way to work, developed by the vendor. So you either stick to it or leave. For many people this seems to be easier, because they can do things only the one correct way. Studio does not have one correct way for everything, it has ways of doing things. However, in your very case, it does not allow you to do a simple thing and unbold text, while other software would allow you to do. Given the situation, you have two solutions: use a workaround in Studio (really not hard to implement for you being a programmer) or use another software for such projects. I doubt SDL would implement unbolding just because you want it. For the majority of cases any extra formatting added to the file may destroy it or will at least mean extra work for someone dealing with the file after you. Both is not really acceptable. If you would need to process files with extra formatting, added by translators by pressing just "Bold" instead of copying the formatting from the source, you would be quite p...d off, as this forces you to do the same stupid work several times for each language in the project. And this just because Studio allows the user to ADD formatting.

I fully agree with Paul: the WYSIWYG view is a misunderstanding and has no advantages at all, but leads people to keep lazy and not to try to understand, how things work.

halit yilmaz said:

if things dont work in it properly, I will be a headache for you guys

We're always here to answer any questions and provide as much help as possible, both those of us who work for SDL and those of us who have used the products for so long that we know how to make it do precisely what we want and want to help other people to enjoy using the product as much as we do!

Primordial to this is that users should keep their software up-to-date (very important nowadays with Studio and MultiTerm, they each MUST be the correct version for the other) AND properly maintained. 

Paul said:

using apps, that are a 5 second job to install in 2021, is definitely beneficial and are a real part of the overall solution you pay for.  Not a workaround at all, rather a way to keep the application lighter since not everyone wants these features.  There are hundreds of app

Absolutely, halit yilmaz, the apps are not workarounds, they are plug-ins made by or approved by SDL, specifically for Studio. They're a USEFUL toolbox of supplementary tools that would make the core product too cumbersome to be practical if they were all incorporated. There is no need to add everything to the core product because individuals need only what is useful to them specifically.

As Paul says there are hundreds of apps! This isn't because Studio doesn't already do what it should, it is because YOU can choose what YOU WANT it to do in addition to the core functionality. I think that is brilliant! You can customise it to work the best way for you. That is what the AppStore is for.

Go take a look 

All the best,

Ali